Brain Based Parenting
Brain Based Parenting, The Boys Ranch Podcast for families.
We all know how hard being a parent is, and sometimes it feels like there are no good answers to the difficult questions families have when their kids are struggling.
Our goal each week will be to try and answer some of those tough questions utilizing the knowledge, experience, and professional training Cal Farley’s Boys Ranch has to offer.
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podcasts@calfarley.org
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For More Information about Cal Farley's Boys Ranch:
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Brain Based Parenting
Anxiety in the Nest: How Overprotection Creates Insecurity
We explore ambivalent attachment, where caregivers' anxiety and overprotection create uncertainty in children, preventing them from developing confidence and decision-making skills. This parenting approach, often seen in helicopter parenting, stems from good intentions but teaches children the world is unsafe.
• Ambivalent attachment develops when caregivers are anxious, overwhelmed or uncertain in their responses to children
• Children with this attachment style appear visibly anxious and often look to caregivers before making decisions
• These children develop internal beliefs that they are unsure, others are confusing, and the world is unsafe
• Helicopter parenting prevents children from experiencing necessary stressors that build resilience
• Children need "predictable, moderate, and controllable" stress to develop confidence
• Creating opportunities for safe failure helps children learn to navigate challenges independently
• Parents should focus on developing self-awareness about their own anxiety triggers
• Ambivalently attached children may be more vulnerable to peer pressure and substance abuse as adolescents
• Adults with ambivalent attachment often struggle with decision-making and may seek controlling relationships
• Healing involves consistent caregiving, creating opportunities for building confidence, and gradually increasing stress tolerance
Join us next week as we discuss disorganized attachment.
Contact:
podcasts@calfarley.org
To Donate:
https://secure.calfarley.org/site/Donation2?3358.donation=form1&df_id=3358&mfc_pref=T
To Apply:
https://apply.workable.com/cal-farleys-boys-ranch/j/25E1226091/
For More Information about Cal Farley's Boys Ranch:
https://www.calfarley.org/
Music:
"Shine" -Newsboys
CCS License No. 9402
Welcome to Brain Based Parenting, the Boys Ranch podcast for families. We all know how hard being a parent is, and sometimes it feels like there are no good answers to the difficult questions families have when their kids are struggling. Our goal each week will be to try and answer some of those tough questions, utilizing the knowledge, experience and professional training Cal Farley's Boys Ranch has to offer. Now here is your host, cal Farley's Staff Development Coordinator, joshua Sprock.
Speaker 2:Welcome back and thank you for joining us today as we talk about brain-based parenting. Today, we're going to continue talking about our attachment styles. Specifically, we're going to discuss ambivalent attachment. To do that again, I'm joined today by Sam Cerna, hello, catherine Clay Hi. And Mike Wilhelm Howdy, josh. Well, today our question is about ambivalence. Ambivalence is defined as being unsure, undecided or hesitant. So my question is what is your response when you're asked for your input on where a group should go eat out? Are you decisive or do you go the I don't know, I don't care route? So for me, I always have an opinion and I know where I want to go, but I'm always the I don't care or I don't know, but you really do care, I do care.
Speaker 4:So then you're just disappointed, yes.
Speaker 3:I'm always disappointed I know that's rough always disappointed, I feel like for me. I go out to eat so infrequently that, if there's the opportunity, I already know where I want to go. So I guess I am more decisive.
Speaker 4:So you'll tell a whole carload of people this is where we're going.
Speaker 3:Well, here's the deal. If I'm going out to eat, it's already been planned. So who wants to go eat at this place? At this time. If it's me by myself, that's fine. If it's a group of people that want to eat there, that's also fine.
Speaker 5:Yeah, I'm generally just trying to do whatever everybody else wants to do. I think I'm a lot like Josh in where I kind of want to go eat a burger, but I don't want to just say it because maybe the other people don't want to go to the same burger place I want to go to Because you're thoughtful. Yeah, sometimes I get snaked to go my way, that's good.
Speaker 4:If I'm in a carload of people that I'm not normally with, I don't want to oversteer, but I will put it out, float it out there that if they're really asking, really want to know, I'd rather not eat fast food. Oh, yeah, there that if they're really asking, really want to know, I'd rather not eat fast food.
Speaker 2:Oh, yeah, but and then. But I do have other preferences, but I'll just let that up to the car to decide. I did hear that if someone mentions like three different places that they want to eat, the first place they mention is usually the place they actually want okay so that's. I don't know if that's actually when. I just heard that on the radio or something that's pretty awesome.
Speaker 4:My wife won't ever. She'll always say you decide, so okay, finally I'll decide. Well, I'm not sure I want to go there, pick another one.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's rough.
Speaker 5:I'm not actually ambivalent then, because when I let my wife decide it, I'm like I don't really want to go there. I don't really want to go there, I don't really want to go there.
Speaker 2:All right, so let's talk about ambivalent attachment. What exactly is ambivalent?
Speaker 5:I mean ambivalence is that, like you said earlier, you may be just indifferent about what to do or about the situation.
Speaker 3:Yeah Well, and I think that's where the title, the ambivalent attachment title, comes from. The caregiver's approach is stressed, anxious, overwhelmed, when they're caregiving, and that produces ambivalence in how to respond, what to do next in regard to the child's behavior.
Speaker 2:So, because of that, what are some of the surface level behaviors associated with ambivalence or that attachment style?
Speaker 3:I think the child would feel a little bit frozen, not knowing what to do next, waiting on their caregiver to signal what to do. We've talked just informally in here about that helicopter parent type title, where the parent's always watching and so the kid's on edge trying to figure out how to respond, what to do, and then that the child might look anxious, unsure, unconfident.
Speaker 5:Yeah, these are the kids that are probably just going to hang around with their parents all the time and not want to leave their side because the world is maybe a little unsafe for them. They're very unsure about what's next?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that anxiety is prevalent in that. So what do caregivers you talked about helicopter parents what do ambivalent parents look like?
Speaker 3:You know, I think helicopter parents are ambivalent parents, though the intent is probably pure and what they believe is best for the child or safe for the child ends up being more the message is that the world isn't safe or I have to take, I have to ensure your safety, I have to keep you from harm, I have to ensure you're not stressed type of stuff, and so then that the parent is kind of just like putting a kid in a bubble and not letting them experience either stressors that are helpful or, you know, failures that are safe, things like that.
Speaker 3:You know, we were talking a minute ago about Dr Bruce Perry and I think there is this notion that stress is bad and we need to avoid stress and what we do the best, we do everything we can to avoid stress, and I think that's a piece of what the parent, the ambivalent type parent believes. But what we know, based off of Bruce Perry, is that stress is not bad. In fact, the stress is necessary. The stressors are necessary as long as they're predictable, moderate and controllable, because those types of stressors lead a child to be resilient. So I don't know what do y'all think?
Speaker 4:I'm wondering. This is a question I have for the three of you being the experts. Avoidant, insecure attachment style seems to produce an avoidant attachment style. Caregiver would seem to produce an avoidant attachment style child. Now this seems different to me. This seems like a very caregiver with a strong need for control is going to produce an ambivalent attachment style where that caregiver themselves may not have ambivalent attachment style. That's a question, that's not a statement. Is that right or does ambivalent do some ambivalent?
Speaker 3:I don't think that there's a hard and fast answer to that. I think you could probably look at a lot of parents' histories and they could fall into any of these categories. There's just so many variables that we don't have or can't explain. I kind of think what you're saying makes sense to me, because the control that you're saying that comes from the ambivalent attachment, the helicopter, the this is the way you do it, you have to stay safe comes from anxiety, fear, you know whatever word, and when we're feeling fearful or we're feeling anxiety, we control. What can we control? Well, I can make sure my daughter or my son doesn't experience an adversity or fear or whatever, and then that creates in the child kind of similar stuff, you know fear to move forward, fear to experience, fear to explore.
Speaker 4:That makes a lot of sense, catherine, in terms of just thinking about Christian spiritual formation in people. When we're acting out of the worst of ourselves, it's usually fear, and it'll tend to come out of one of three different areas and different combinations, but either a need for power, control, or a need for safety, security, or a need for affection, and then again and just varying combinations, but you could see lots of different caregivers that acting out of fear from one source or another. I'm needing to control things. This child is one of the things that I need to control, and what you're saying is we're going to arrest their development if they're not able to experience some mistakes on their own, some venturing out, scraping a knee, that sort of thing, right?
Speaker 3:As you're speaking, I'm thinking of, like there might be a stage in life where it feels normal for a kid to look back at a parent or a caregiver to say can I proceed, should I go this way? Is this safe? And I think that there's probably a season that that's appropriate. But the difference being is that the caregiver does that style the whole development right. So like a 13-year-old should probably not be looking back at a parent to see should I cross the street or is this safe? Like they need to develop that internal process and that internal skill so that they can be independent of that caregiver. And if that's not developed, then I would imagine kids that grow up with this type of caregiving lack the ability to make decisions or be independent or develop into adulthood without needing some reassurance or some help making decisions or just caregiving constantly throughout life yeah, and these two kids, I mean, like you, you asked or said earlier uh, it's a, it's, it's a contrasting.
Speaker 5:the difference is that you know the, the kid we talked about last time, oh, the avoidant, the avoidant child.
Speaker 5:Sorry, it's going to seem confident, it's going to seem secure and this child is not going to seem that way Very anxious and maybe, like you said, try to take control of a situation and they might get in a little trouble over it because, right, their need and anxiety is going to have to create them. Maybe, you know, maybe they might take over the class, or, or you know, or anything like that, where the other child is is going to just maybe just be compliant and seem confident.
Speaker 3:This child will not seem confident I think you'll be able to see it visibly too yeah, you know like we were saying with the avoidant, there they maybe look kind of cool, calm, collected. I think this kind of child you're going to be able to see.
Speaker 2:You'll see and feel.
Speaker 3:Yes, the stirring.
Speaker 4:Meet that child with that primary caregiver and ask the child a question that child's probably going to have. The deer in the headlights look and then look at the caregiver right, Like I said.
Speaker 3:There's a time that you would think well, that's pretty normal. But if that's a 15-year-old being asked what do you want for dinner or what do you want off the McDonald's menu, and the child is deer in headlights, looks at the parent, then that's not.
Speaker 4:I was thinking, Sam, how many times have you seen that interviewing a couple and asking questions, and one of the two is the one that does all the?
Speaker 4:answer and then you finally reach that point that you really do want to draw something out of the other, so you really are directing towards the other. And that's when you realize, oh, you watch, and that person will just look to the other, to the partner, and won't answer and it's like, okay, this is a, this has a weird feel and that person is not secure about answering on their own.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 4:So we grow into it as adults, don't we?
Speaker 5:Yeah, we do. It surely does affect your adulthood. Imagine these two different styles getting together as parents how that affects the kids.
Speaker 2:That's interesting, interesting conversation.
Speaker 2:So I was thinking too. You guys talked about how these different parenting styles look. I think the intention of those parenting styles is interesting to contrast. So an occurer and an ambivalent I think intention of those parenting styles is interesting to contrast. So in a cure and a ambivalent, I think have similar intentions. They're trying to get the kids needs met in that security the secure attachment person is. They have that, I don't know safety and security built in, whereas the ambivalent parent they have the right intention but the kid never feels that sense of relief because that anxiety overrides their good intention.
Speaker 2:Do you think that's going to impact that child's behavior?
Speaker 5:Yes, because I believe that when a kiddo can, or even a young adult, let's say a teenage child, they're so anxious, they have this ingrained need to control the environment, if they can. Because of that need, they're unsure or they can even be frozen in place and they'll don't know what to do. And so there's a ton of way you can see these things manifest in their life, and I, you know, I think of, and I was thinking about the caregivers, all these different secure, attached caregivers. I used to watch my kids play on the slide right and this old park we used to have in my hometown.
Speaker 5:It was kind of a tall slide, you know, and it was metal, and I remember watching my kids, you know, climb that slide and my guts were inching Right, and so I would imagine that I was a secure parent. I let them actually climb it. Yeah, and my heart's in my chest and they're sliding down. They survived it, yay, pray. They're going to fall off the slide. All these anxieties are going to happen. This ambivalent person would probably not even let the child go up there, or they'd go up there with them, which?
Speaker 3:maybe that's not a bad thing. We're avoiding that totally Well, and I like that you brought that up, because I think that that's kind of like what Josh said it's a slippery slope or slide. It's a slippery slide between the secure and the ambivalent.
Speaker 5:Just completely intended.
Speaker 3:Because I do the same thing with my kids. You know. I've had to retrain myself to say so. I have my two-year-old and I did it with my five-year-old too. But I had to retrain myself to say, instead of say that's not safe when he would climb or she would climb, or whatever, I would say hey, bud, or hey, honey, is that stable, is that unstable, is that? And so I would.
Speaker 3:The change in my language and the change in my approach, because I felt that internal like, oh my goodness, my child's about to fall off of whatever, when really it was like, you know, very minimal risk, and I changed the way that I approached it, gave my child the opportunity to say is this stable? Is this something I should climb on or something I should sit on? Is this something I should walk around or not walk on at all? And that process of learning, that barrier, that stressor, whatever it was, was now internalized, rather than me being the one that had to pick out the harm, or me be the one to say that's not safe or that's safe, because if that's not internalized, they will need me to do that forever and that's not ideal. It's kind of like what you're're saying letting them experience. A stressor that's predictable and moderate and controllable, like this giant slide you're talking about with you standing by, will teach them one way or the other that this is a good slide or bad slide or whatever. You know.
Speaker 5:Whatever the barrier stressor is, whatever it is you know, I really like how you, how you um said that you, you tell them what to expect and have them use their senses to feel, because I, you know, right, like I said, that's all part of the teaching process not easy. I mean, wouldn't that, wouldn't that increase their confidence right in life? Right, because when you're not around, right.
Speaker 1:They have to be able to make decisions correct right, they can feel it.
Speaker 5:Does this feel okay?
Speaker 3:this does not feel okay, you know yeah, and it's endearing to hear like a little one say this is stable, this is unstable I'm like I think I've done at least this thing right, this little piece I've done. Okay, you know because parenting is difficult.
Speaker 2:Well, I, gotta say I am a helicopter parent, okay good, this is what's here. Some full disclosure here you worked hard for that title too. You're not wrong. So one of the things my wife always tells me, though, is that some point our daughters are going to go to college, and like am I? I going to be there at college to make sure.
Speaker 1:Did you say yes, well, I do.
Speaker 2:I think that is actually what I want to do but, local, but I mean, at some point they're going to have to fly out of the nest and if they haven't learned to fail in a safe environment, then they're not going to be able to be successful once they leave us. So maybe you guys could talk about a little bit what does it mean to fail in a safe environment? How can we help kids do that?
Speaker 5:So Catherine touched on earlier about I should just let you say it but creating instances in which they can go explore and increase a little bit of stress.
Speaker 5:So you start small. You open a child's world, so at first they're a lot inside with you. And when you open a child's world, right, so at first they're a lot inside with you and when you take them outside they're near you and that's all natural, right. But soon, right, letting them go a little further from you, that where they can still see you, um, and and try new things and explore and touch and um, you know, so they can. So what I'm saying, I guess is too, is of um, if they're trying to build something or or navigate an obstacle and maybe they fall off, hopefully it's a foot off the ground and they fall down.
Speaker 5:Well, they failed, but here I am to be there with them and tell them how to do it better, or, or, or how to navigate. Yes, the thing you know.
Speaker 3:I think it's also the, the difference being that, when they do fail, that we look at it. I think it's easy and maybe I've, probably, I think I've probably done this where, when they fail, they fall and get hurt, let's say, and I'll, it's in my gut to say, see, but I told you don't jump on that or don't climb on that and I'm guilty, I've done that.
Speaker 3:The better response that I try to say is okay, so what'd we learn here? That was unstable or whatever it may be. Rather than when you fall, you fail and we don't do that, we don't try that again, rather, climb again. Let's just do it a little bit differently, maybe wear better shoes or whatever it may be, and then there's learning inside of that. I think that feels safe, right. I know I can go and do something a little risky or something that's explorative, and if it works, great. If it doesn't, I'll come back and try to figure out what went wrong and how to do it differently. Again, lots of internal work as a parent to be able to do that, because when I say, but I see, I told you don't do that, that's my own anxiety and fear coming out and I don't want to put that in my child, you know.
Speaker 5:And I also think it's about creating challenge, right? So I took my grandkids to a park the other day, and that's where you really learn about the kids, right? Sometimes I think they're super brave, right, sometimes. Sometimes I think they're super brave and sometimes I think they're scaredy cats, and I am very almost 100 surprised because I'm obviously I'm not with my grandkids all the time right um so, and I don't take them to the park all the time, but when I do, here's where I noticed so I had.
Speaker 5:There was a. One of my grandsons used to be scared of everything and now he's jumping and running and climbing and doing it's incredible he was so fearful and and to see this growth he's had, and now my other grandson, who I thought was braver, um, we were jumping some of the leap pads, that kind of ascend and he wouldn't do it and I'm like it's not even that high right you know so then I'm like okay, so how do I challenge him here?
Speaker 5:hey, well, let me hold your hand, can you take a step? And then if in at some point, if they're not comfortable, that's where I I got to make the decision. How much worth is it today?
Speaker 5:for me to push this? Or should I let them fail today and that's OK, yeah and so and right, and then we try again next time, or I have his brother model it, so Right. So there's tons of ways that we can set up that it's safe that if he was to fall he's not going to get hurt. This playground is, it's not like? Our old playgrounds right there's spikes at the bottom of everything, right, but I think that's a cool way to have them fail in a safe environment.
Speaker 3:Yes, that's a good example.
Speaker 4:That's what Sam, what you and Catherine just shared, and Josh, that really important for faith development of kids and here's why An ambivalent attachment child with anxiety might find themselves in a situation where they're going to tend to be. They'll tend to struggle more with the God piece, but whenever they do come to faith or to conversion it would be the classic what we would call the twice born, and usually there's more emotion involved and it really is a way to try to relieve anxiety. Doesn't mean it's not authentic what's going on, necessarily, but it has that element Now that faith is going to be less resilient because, as we know, if you read the book of Job or you read through most of the Bible, life happens, sometimes in an unfortunate way and that child that's never learned that sometimes things aren't safe, sometimes bad things happen, that hasn't had some of that patterning, they're going to really struggle with the faith piece. That faith piece will be less stable.
Speaker 4:And something that I've learned as a chaplain here in residential child care community that I didn't know and maybe there's some listeners that have taken children into their home that have come from hard places, kids that have ambivalent attachment styles. We need to really be patient and wise and loving with those children and if we're hasty with some kind of religious intervention, those children just to relieve anxiety will comply. And whatever it is the expectation is, if we round them up and take them to a big youth event that has a hellfire and brimstone altar call, well, that child is going to need to relieve that anxiety and they're going to fall right in line with that. Is that going to be something healthy as far as faith formation? I'd question that. In fact I think it might be something harmful rather than healthy going on. So we need to be real careful. That child with that ambivalent attachment style coming from a hard place might seem super compliant as well if we're helicopter parenting and that compliance might not be growth at all.
Speaker 4:So yeah what you've shared is very helpful in my thought, so I appreciate what you both said. Thank you, mike.
Speaker 2:So let's look at if we have a caregiver who has the correct intentions, trying to meet the child's needs, but overwhelmed with those feelings of anxiety, uncertainty, nervousness. Or is that helicopter parent that's going to shape how we see the world? So if this is my template, what would my I am statement be? Here I am.
Speaker 3:Unsure An.
Speaker 2:What would my I am statement be here? I am Unsure, anxious, yeah, confused.
Speaker 5:Others are. Well, they're confusing.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 5:Or maybe scary.
Speaker 3:Yeah, anxious.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the world is Unsafe, Unsafe and therefore I must Hide.
Speaker 3:Yeah, do anything. Control, be safe, control.
Speaker 2:And I think you're just going to be paralyzed by fear. I've heard it said that this current generation is one of the most anxious generations ever, and I think it's because people like primary caregiver, helicopter parent moving into adolescence or settings where they're not around that caregiver?
Speaker 4:are they going to be more susceptible to peer pressure or less?
Speaker 2:so I've heard actually a lot of research on that. Peer pressure and substance abuse is actually pretty high in these because they're in the state of anxious anxiety all the time and they've never experienced a sense of relief. So when they have either inappropriate relationships or substance abuse it has a disproportionate effect on that relief. They have that ah moment that they've never experienced before, and it becomes, that becomes an addicting experience.
Speaker 3:Well, and I think, aside from like the natural process and development of kiddos, the age that you're talking about, it's like a bomb setting off for peer pressure, belonging, all that stuff Coming into adolescence being even more unsure than you already are as an adolescent you know, or looking for someone to tell you what to do next. You know, it's just such a vulnerable time for that.
Speaker 5:Yeah, mike, and you said a good word. You said low resilience and you know people who are low resilience are more susceptible to things they cannot take a hit maybe than a more resilient person could. And what builds resilience is adversity right. And if kids don't get to go out and experience things as young kids or even teenagers, it becomes harder to take on anything that might be challenging, and I don't mean like work stuff I'm talking about. You know, those hits that we talk about a death in the family could be very impactful to these kids or these adults, even because they just don't have the toughness built up to cope. So they're going to find other coping mechanisms to do so, to help relieve that stress. And that was so insightful.
Speaker 4:I never thought about that, you know, because it's similar to the previous attachments that we talked about was that these people could also sink into any kind of addiction or video games or technology, also because it feels good that release and all that Because, right, it's all about the stress here, that that stress is very high I have noticed that from a pastor's viewpoint, watching the ambivalent attachment child with well-meaning folks hauling that child to youth of christian youth events that had a strong altar call component, and well that child is, we'll come back and hear the news that child got saved, okay. Well, if there's an event two months later, you know what I'm going to find out if that child went they got saved again and they'll get saved every time.
Speaker 4:And what happens is, my goodness, there's something harmful going on. If you ever drove a standard transmission vehicle with a clutch, if it's misappropriated you'll strip out the clutch and eventually you just can't get any traction anymore. And I really think there's something harmful that goes on with faith development If we don't take good care of ambivalent, attached kids and be patient. The best pastoral advice I could give parents that have a child that's with ambivalent attachment as far as faith formation is to really focus on your relationship with the child and to focus on and be aware, catherine, as you said before, of self-awareness and what anxiety am I bringing into this relationship and what do I need to do to be a non-anxious presence in the life of this child. That's going to be the most helpful thing you could do in God's name for the sake of that child.
Speaker 3:That is great.
Speaker 1:So, what do you think?
Speaker 2:the impact of this attachment style will have on these kids when they do become adults.
Speaker 5:They're not going to trust a lot, they're going to have a hard time forming attachments as well themselves. I can imagine what anxiousness in a relationship is like. How can you know the other person has your back if you're just always anxious about are they going to leave me? I'm not good enough. I don't know what to do. That must be difficult as an adult.
Speaker 3:Well, I think, too kind of speaking to the partnership relationship like you're speaking about and you guys had mentioned, I think, interviewing a couple, and I think you'd probably find that you would an ambivalent attachment person or someone who is ambivalently attached will look for someone to play the role that the parent played which is telling them how to proceed, protecting them from harm those types of behaviors.
Speaker 3:I think you'll see that paired up. And then I think too, if you're looking at someone in the workplace, you would probably see someone who has difficult time making decisions, who kind of looks to others to take on leadership or to make decisions. Probably doesn't take very many risks, probably would be in a job that is limited, low risk, which you know. There's plenty of jobs that are like that. But I think too it would be hard to be an adult working in your workplace not being able to make decisions with confidence.
Speaker 5:Well, that sounds like an adult that would always need to be dependent on somebody else whether in their relationship or at work.
Speaker 3:When it goes back to that. What I sense about that early caregiving is there's a little bit of enmeshment happening right, and so I'm not okay unless you're okay, and you're not okay unless.
Speaker 3:I'm okay, so it's that codependency piece and so, speaking about like romantic relationships or workplace relationships, there is maybe some codependency pieces that pop up that I need to know that my boss is okay before I'm okay, or I need to know that my partner is okay before I'm okay and I can't be okay unless this other person is, or I can't be well or whatever. I mean we can all kind of think about how that might play out in behaviors and relationships and things like that.
Speaker 5:Well, because I imagine the partner may feel smothered a little bit, even if that's not what they need, or they have a secure attachment style. It could actually inadvertently push people away, maybe even it's interesting.
Speaker 4:Yeah, and to live in a state of worry that will choke out just quality living there's no peace and joy Just don't seem to coexist with worry.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 4:So yeah, I think we'll rob ourselves of our best life.
Speaker 2:I think it's interesting if you think about people with anxiety. We don't really like being around people who are nervous all the time. Right, that nervous energy scares us, and I think these people that feel like that they don't like other people too.
Speaker 4:So it's like two ends of the same ends of a magnet that kind of repel each other away, which, like you said, Mike, isn't really the recipe for joy in your life, or adventure and creativity. They seem to emerge out of feeling safe and secure, and if we're anxious, we're not going to be as creative and as adventurous are we.
Speaker 2:So what can we do to help these kids move to a place of more security in their attachment?
Speaker 3:I feel like it goes back to what we spoke about earlier consistent consistency, creating opportunities, kind of repairing some of those developmental misses, I guess you could say, where we might give them opportunity to explore and then fail, and then explore and then fail, creating some confidence in that, maybe giving them small decisions to make, showing that you can make a decision and look it turned out okay, kind of dosing those experiences a little bit. But it kind of goes back to what Mike was saying. I think if we come at this super fast, super quick, super intimate, then I think that they will just spike their anxiety right.
Speaker 5:And so I think being mindful, being, being curious, producing opportunity for small amount of stress, increase their stress tolerance, that type of stuff could be helpful yeah same thing for the caregiver right the caregiver needs to be mindful of what they're feeling and how, how they are responding, their internal stuff, so that way they're not sending the stuff out to the the kid Because, right, what we're talking about all the time is the caregiver creates this in a way. So the caregiver now has to be aware and give all the things that Catherine said, but it's also just being aware of yourself and how you can help support the child to help them feel secure.
Speaker 2:Well, thank you guys. This is a great discussion and thank you guys all for spending some time with us today. Don't stress out about it. Go ahead and commit to coming back here next week when we're going to discuss disorganized attachment. Until then, remember you might have to loan out your frontal lobes today. Just make sure you remember to get them back.
Speaker 1:We hope you enjoyed this show. If you would like more information about Cal Farley's Boys Ranch, are interested in employment, would like information about placing your child, or would like to help us help children by donating to our mission, please visit calfarleyorg. You can find us on all social media platforms by searching for Cal Farley's. Thank you for spending your time with us and have a blessed day.
